 Member ◆◆◆ Posts: 1,290 Joined: Nov 2000 From: Bavaria, DE |
#9▸ Posted: 20 Nov 1999, 21:12 CET
That last line is the honest heart of the thread: maybe two things, maybe wrong twice. Keep that sentence. It is better than any certainty we could sell you.
The dog on the camera is not a humiliation. It is a subtraction. You have removed one predator from one night, and that is what field work usually looks like. The folklore does the opposite thing -- it adds a shape. The working record should subtract, and only after it has subtracted all it can should we permit ourselves to ask what remains.
Bavaria · subtract before you name the Beast |
 Member ◆◆ Posts: 3,010 Joined: Mar 2001 From: Kent, UK |
#10▸ Posted: 13 Jan 2000, 20:04 GMT
I know I am the sort of person Occams keeps a folded chair for, but I have a Kent one. Friend of mine got a black animal crossing stubble behind a hedgerow in August, long tail, low body, not moving like a fox. I saw the print, not just the photo. It was about the width of my palm.
Before you all jump on me: yes, no scale in the picture. Yes, the print was already in hard dry mud and I did not cast it because I did not know this thread existed. But I have walked that field for years and there are domestic cats there and this was not that. There are ABC reports all over Kent and most are nonsense. This one has been bothering me.
Kent · wants to believe, tries not to |
 Member ◆◆◆ Posts: 3,110 Joined: Aug 1999 From: Oregon, US |
#11▸ Posted: 07 Mar 2000, 13:42 PST
Al, a palm-width print in hard dry mud is a bad ruler. Dry mud shrinks and cracks and the edges lie. A house cat track can look huge if the animal slips or if the mud breaks away at the edge. That long tail in a hedgerow photo is not useless, but without fence height, crop row width, or the distance to the hedge it is not evidence yet.
Go back to the field. Measure the gate posts. Measure the distance between crop rows if the field still has rows. Photograph the same hedge with a person standing where the animal crossed. If you can get a repeat frame with the same camera, do that. I do not want to win an argument. I want scale.
Oregon · get me scale or get me ground |
Anonymous Coward  (unregistered) User ID: 34702723 From: Midlands, not putting my name here |
#12▸ Posted: 30 Apr 2000, 00:38 GMT
Escaped exotics is not a fairy tale. I used to deliver feed to a private collection near a market town, not saying where, late 90s. Cats, not lions but smaller stuff, and paperwork that would make a council man cry. Collection "folded" after the owner died and three animals supposedly went to a sanctuary. One definitely did. One I saw in a van. The third I never saw leave and nobody asked because nobody official wanted to know the collection had existed.
Does that mean your Beast is real? no. Means Occams is right about the boring five percent. There are cats out there because rich idiots get bored and doors rust.
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 Resident Skeptic ◆◆◆◆◆ Posts: 16,720 Joined: Apr 1998 From: Chicago, US |
#13▸ Posted: 23 Jun 2000, 20:17 CST
That anonymous post is exactly why I keep saying "escaped exotic" instead of "nothing." The boring explanation is not tame. A private collection folding badly is a real generator, and it generates rumours, bad photographs, dead sheep, denials, and one or two actual cats.
But it still does not buy Hexenring a medieval panther. It buys a contemporary animal with contemporary teeth. The denominator now has another column: illegal collection, circus, private menagerie, misidentified dog, domestic cat at distance, hoax, and maybe one genuine leopardish thing that nobody wants on the insurance paperwork. The old stories explain how people talk about it. They do not explain how it got out of a cage.
Chicago · the boring answer has claws too |
 Member ◆◆◆ Posts: 1,720 Joined: Jul 1999 From: Toulouse, FR |
#14▸ Posted: 16 Aug 2000, 11:28 CET
I carried the collection note over to the Europe desk because this is precisely the sort of thing that crosses borders without crossing language. France has the same problem: private animals, half-recorded seizures, a mayor who would rather say "chien errant" than admit a felin is in his commune. The files are dull and therefore useful.
For the Bete du Gevaudan, please be careful. It is not proof of a surviving monster. It is proof that administrative closure is old. The authorities named a wolf because a wolf is a category they could kill, pay for, and close. The archive is full of names doing work. "Dog" does that work now. "Wolf" did it then.
Toulouse · a category can close a file before it explains it |
 Senior Member ◆◆◆◆ Posts: 5,210 Joined: Apr 1999 From: Trøndelag, NO |
#15▸ Posted: 09 Oct 2000, 22:04 CET
A practical addition for the farmers and walkers: put a ruler in the camera frame BEFORE something happens. A stake with black and white bands at 10 cm intervals, beside the gate or carcass, is better than a perfect animal photograph with no reference. If you cannot put a stake, use the gate rails and measure them later. Log moon, rain, and wind. Rain matters because tracks lie differently after it.
Most of your nights will show fox, dog, badger, nothing. Keep them. The empty nights tell you what visits the field when no story is present.
Trondelag · the empty nights count |
 Member ◆◆◆ Posts: 1,290 Joined: Nov 2000 From: Bavaria, DE |
#16▸ Posted: 03 Dec 2000, 19:51 CET
Pierre is right about names closing files. Folklore is full of such names: werewolf, black dog, devil-cat, witch animal. Each is a drawer you put fear into so the village can decide what to do next. Sometimes what to do next is hunt. Sometimes it is pray. Sometimes it is keep the children indoors for a month and then stop speaking of it.
That does not make the drawer false. It makes it social technology. "Dog attack" is also a drawer. It is merely modern, insured, and stamped by a vet.
Bavaria · every age has its drawer |