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PARALLAX  »  ESOTERICA, ENERGY & PROPHECY  »  Energy Work & Healing  »  "Scalar energy" gadgets -- this is just the free-energy guys with crystals, right?
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"Scalar energy" gadgets -- this is just the free-energy guys with crystals, right?
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K7RADIO
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From: Arizona, US
#1▸ Posted: 21 Apr 1998, 09:00 GMT
Right. The "scalar energy" pendant and gadget threads. As the resident ham who actually understands fields and has the burns to prove it:

there is no such thing as a scalar electromagnetic wave that does what these adverts claim. "Scalar" got borrowed from a perfectly real bit of maths -- the scalar potential -- and bolted onto a crystal and a blinking LED, and the device sitting on your desk is a battery, a light, and a hope in a nice box.

i say this with love, because half of you are genuinely lovely people who got SOLD a thing by someone who isn't. Rule of thumb: if it has a 9-volt battery, a blinking light, a forty-dollar price tag, and the word QUANTUM anywhere on the packaging, it is jewellery. Wear it if it makes you feel steadier -- placebo is real and not nothing -- just don't tell me it's physics. Bring me one and i will open it on the bench in front of you. It is always, always an LED.
K7 · it's always an LED
Anonymous Coward
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#2▸ Posted: 14 May 1998, 16:05 MST
I have to disagree completely. I bought one of these pendants six months ago and it has genuinely improved my sleep, and my headaches are nearly gone. The doctor said it was stress, but the pendant worked where nothing else did. There is more to the world than what your instruments can measure, K7RADIO. Just because you do not understand it does not mean it is not real.
TESLA_DROPOUT
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From: Fairbanks AK, US
#3▸ Posted: 05 Jun 1998, 16:47 MST
Both of you are wrong, and I am angry at both of you for exactly the same reason.

K7RADIO: you are right that the pendant does not do what the ad copy claims. But you are wrong to wave off the scalar potential as a harmless mathematical fiction. The Aharonov-Bohm effect is real. It is measured. It is in the textbooks. A charged particle can be influenced by a potential in a region where the electric and magnetic fields are both zero. That is not incense talk, that is 1959 experimental physics.

And you, the believer: you feel better, and that is real. But your feeling better does not prove the thing around your neck caused it. That is not how evidence works. That is how hope works. They are not the same.

Here is what makes me furious: the people selling this STOLE the word "scalar." They took a real, difficult, genuinely beautiful piece of theoretical physics, borrowed from Maxwell and from gauge theory, and turned it into incense for people with money and anxiety. They cheapen the actual physics so badly that when a real ham like K7RADIO tries to explain it, he has to spend his breath denying nonsense instead of teaching something true. That pendant is not based on Aharonov-Bohm. If it were you would need superconductors and very particular geometries, not a crystal and an LED. Derive it from Maxwell, not from incense. That is what I demand of all of you.
TESLA_DROPOUT -- Fairbanks, AK
Occams_Razorback
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From: Chicago, US
#4▸ Posted: 28 Jun 1998, 18:22 CST
The believer reports that the headaches went away. That is observation one. Observation two: the believer bought a pendant. These are not the same as observation three, that the pendant caused the headaches to go away.

There is a denominator being ignored. How many people bought these and felt nothing? We do not hear from them. We hear from the one for whom the headaches happened to improve in a six-month window during which he was also wearing a shiny thing he believed in. That is placebo. It is not small and it is not fake -- it is a real neurological effect -- but it is not evidence that the device works through "scalar energy" or any other mechanism. The burden of proof is on the person making the claim, and "I feel better" is not proof. It is hope.
Occams_Razorback -- Chicago, IL
Anonymous Coward
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#5▸ Posted: 20 Jul 1998, 09:14 MST
So six months of better sleep is just luck, then? I spent years chasing the right medication. I spent money on doctors who did not help. Then I bought this for seventy-five dollars and it worked. You people can say what you like about science, but I know what I experienced.
delta_v_Dan
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From: Huntsville AL, US
#6▸ Posted: 12 Aug 1998, 11:27 CST
Here is what I propose. I am an engineer in Huntsville and I work with precision measurement and environmental control. I will run a proper test of the pendant's claims. Blind, with controls, with real instruments.

We can test for any electromagnetic emission. We can measure whether it changes the resistance of human tissue. We can test for radiant output of any kind, in a controlled setting with independent observation. Show me one measurement that survives a control condition and I will change my position. I am not asking for proof that it cures headaches -- placebo is real and it works. I am asking for evidence that the device emits anything at all distinguishable from a battery and an LED. Anyone with one of these is welcome to send it to me. I will test it and publish the results.
delta_v_Dan -- Huntsville, AL
K7RADIO
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From: Arizona, US
#7▸ Posted: 04 Sep 1998, 14:35 MST
TESLA_DROPOUT is right, and I owe him the acknowledgment. I was speaking loosely about the scalar potential because I was angry at the marketing, not because the mathematics is wrong. The Aharonov-Bohm effect is real and I should not have implied otherwise. My apologies.

But the pendant still does not use it. To use it you would need to build something so sophisticated you could not sell it for seventy-five dollars -- real geometry, real quantum mechanics, not a crystal and a hope. Believer: your sleep improved, I believe you, but it improved in your body, not in the pendant. The pendant may have been the thought-object that let your mind relax. That is not small -- that is actually profound -- but it is not scalar energy. It is trust and expectation and the power of breathing and twenty quiet minutes while holding something you believe in.
K7RADIO -- Tucson, AZ
Anonymous Coward
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#8▸ Posted: 26 Sep 1998, 15:22 MST
delta_v_Dan, I am not interested in your test. You are a clipboard man. You will measure what you are looking for and you will not measure what matters. The subtle energies cannot be caught in your equipment because equipment is too gross. Science cannot measure everything. Some things you have to feel.
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